Australasian 2010-2011 Major Tournaments Discussion

Posted by scottles on 01 Sep 2010

Over the last couple of months, a group email has been floating around with discussion about Australasian Majors. There's been a lot of ground covered already, but we really need to discuss this in a forum so that everyone can have a say, not just 'representatives' from each city.

Lewis started the thread with:
"One of the main things to take away I think is really the broader national/continental view of things that North America is taking. Planning a year of the NA Hardcourt endorsed "tour", including major tournaments in each region. This isnt designed to exclude other tournaments, rather to help make organizing the Majors easier. Pooling work on rules (national ruleset?!), tournament structure, organization and sponsors. I think this is really crucial. It allows us to present a united front to sponsors and adds a huge sense of legitimacy to our appearance.

What I would like to propose is something similar for Australia, and also extend this to New Zealand. The recent goings on with bikepolo.com.au are a good step to help this process. We now have full access to the site and are able to utilize it as a tool to its best potential"

Other items discussed:
- Number of Majors per year. Possibly 4 to fit in around school holidays (cheap flights) and public holidays (less time off work)
"Based on the number of players in Australia (few) and distance/expense involved, we need to make it as easy as possible for people to travel interstate so that we can have the numbers for a fantastic tournament. We don't really have the luxury of millions of players to populate tournaments. Based on this premise, Majors need to be structured around 1) school holiday / peak travel periods to get nice cheap flights 2) public holidays so people don't need to take so much time off work. I started a google calendar with all polo states' school holidays. feel free to add public holidays and tell the list." -
Calendar address:
ical ==> http://www.google.com/calendar/ical/86g57q8cebm3bp0ghtqp92f1bo%40group.c...
html ==> http://www.google.com/calendar/embed?src=86g57q8cebm3bp0ghtqp92f1bo%40gr...
- Sponsors - people aren't overly concerned with prizes, would rather effort went into organisation of event over sponsorship
- 2v2, Bench Minor & Throw Up - How do these fit into deciding ranking points for Worlds selection. How do we want to determine ranking? by team? individual? individual with team aggregate? team with substitutions accounted for somehow?
- Isn't money-in-the-bank the biggest decider for worlds selection?

Groups:

Australasia

virginia

Sydney Bike Polo

So can we agree that the Nationals/Australasian Championships will be held in Adelaide in May 2011?

Sydney would like to do the Waitangi Day tournament again on 6 February 2011. We don't care if this is deemed a major tournament or not - it's happening!

www.goalhole.com
www.sydneybikepolo.org

Dingo

Melbourne

I think we are jumping the gun a bit on this one.

First and foremost what I would like to see is:

Tournaments to be announced in advance so:
that people can book flights and plan time off work/family.
and that dates, especially long weekends aren't double booked in different cities.

Scott's calendar can be really helpful in this regard for cities to identify good times for a tournament, and put their hand up.

Here is a list of all the tournaments held in Australia in the past few years.
http://www.bikepolo.com.au/tournaments/

I've got lots more comments on prizes/sponsors/points and rankings for teams and individuals but I think we need to focus on the basics first.

Damon

--
bikepolo.com.au
urbanbicyclist.org

buildingbridges...

Toronto

Seriously we arent at a point where we need to go into rankings and point systems and all that. its too hard and its not needed.

How about cities start proposing here when and where they would like to hold a tournament, and we can start creating a bit of a calendar. Don't mind if someone else has already put something on that weekend. Just put it out there what your city would like to do, and we can start bringing it all together......

buildingbridges...

Toronto

Can we make it so other people can add to the calendar?

Dingo

Melbourne

Here is all of Australias Public Holidays

http://australia.gov.au/topics/australian-facts-and-figures/public-holidays

I'm just guessing out loud here, but...

Melbourne has run it's Autumn Tournament in May 2 years in a row now.
I'd consider this our main tourney... it's in May, which might clash with the Nationals from now on. (and I like the idea of nationals in May after a good summer of polo) Maybe we could have it in April? Maybe it could become the Victorian championships?

I'd also like to see the Australia Day bench run again and get some interstate visitors.
(with 2 days we could play a mixed day and a play with your city day)

We've also had something linked to the BFF (now Bike Fest) in November each year (2008 and 2009).

Damon

--
bikepolo.com.au
urbanbicyclist.org

chapstix

Living in Xanadu (no one knows where or how far Perth is) it would be awesome if everyone could announce their tournaments at least 3 months in advance. There are 9 of us coming to the nationals, only because we had some advance warning so we could get cheaper flights.
For the same reason qualifying for anything seems premature, Australasia is too big and we are too few to worry about this for another few years.
Our focus should still be on attracting more players, council approval and cultivating more sponsors and media interest.

has amazing uses

buildingbridges...

Toronto

chapstix wrote:

For the same reason qualifying for anything seems premature, Australasia is too big and we are too few to worry about this for another few years.
Our focus should still be on attracting more players, council approval and cultivating more sponsors and media interest.

THIS! Count it!!!

Dingo

Melbourne

>There are 9 of us coming to the nationals

Super impressive turn out Perth! last time I checked thats over $600 a piece. Well done (and a testament to preannounced/confirmed dates for tourneys)

>Our focus should still be on attracting more players, council approval and cultivating more sponsors and media interest.

and more mad polo skillz!

--
bikepolo.com.au
urbanbicyclist.org

mossko

Melbourne

Yeah I also would like to see the Autumn tournament remaining in May - It's one of our biggest tournaments and one that we'd like to keep it going

Why did Adelaide want to host the Nationals in May anyhow? Was it for ranking for the Worlds? Also, are we saying that teams ranked higher up have first preference to attend the Worlds?

It would be much simpler if the Nationals always happened in the same month

What are peoples thoughts on Trophies and Medallions for the 1st/2nd/3rd place prizes?

mossko / Rob M
http://www.vimeo.com/ mossko | http://www.bikepolo.com.au/ | http://www.flickr.com/photos/mosskopolo

#10

buildingbridges...

Toronto

mossko wrote:

Why did Adelaide want to host the Nationals in May anyhow? Was it for ranking for the Worlds? Also, are we saying that teams ranked higher up have first preference to attend the Worlds?

It would be much simpler if the Nationals always happened in the same month

It would be much simpler if Nationals stayed in the same month every year. But that doesn't mean just because it happened in November the first year that that is the right time of the year to have it.
I feel nationals should have priority to which time of the year it is held. A few reasons why i see around may as a good time for nationals:

- Weather is still good
- Its the end of summer, i.e the end of the season, which makes more sense than holding it right after winter when things have slowed down a bit.
- As/if more people start wanting to go to worlds we will need some kind of preference list. Those who rank higher in Nationals should get priority to go to worlds. If they dont care to go or cant afford it, the spots can be handed down the list. - hosting in may gives us time to figure who is going and still buy flights at affordable prices.
- Holding nationals in november seems silly as its nearly a full year ahead of worlds - alot can change in a year.....

Its good to see Melbourne keen to host a lot of tourneys this coming year, but I would like to ask that they choose one date that they push hardest for, and wait till other cities have claimed time slots before scheduling their other tourneys around that. I would hate to see one city claim lots of weekends in the calendar then leave other cities to take the leftovers.

#11

virginia

Sydney Bike Polo

I agree that Nationals should have priority over any other tournament and the host should be able to pick any date they want (being several months prior to Worlds). Neil already gave good reasons in his email why May would suit Adelaide:

"I am going to put it out there now and recommend that the 2011 Nationals in Adelaide to be held in early May.
My reasons for suggesting this time:
-it will be before the WHBPC sometime in the northern summer
-The weather wont have totally packed-a-sad by then,
-It is after the dirty big car race/bogan festival, they have here, is cleaned up allowing us potential use of the starting grid area for courts. This area is huge and smooth. 
-It is shortly after the April school holidays so flights should be cheaper."

www.goalhole.com
www.sydneybikepolo.org

#12

Dingo

Melbourne

mossko said:
>Yeah I also would like to see the Autumn tournament remaining in May
>It's one of our biggest tournaments and one that we'd like to keep it going

I dont really get the logical link between these 2 statements, We can easily hold the Autumn tournament in April.

>Why did Adelaide want to host the Nationals in May anyhow? Was it for ranking for the Worlds?

Bunch of reasons covered already and I agree.

>Also, are we saying that teams ranked higher up have first preference to attend the Worlds?

Yes. we were lucky this year, we may not have as many spots next year.

>It would be much simpler if the Nationals always happened in the same month

This is not more important than having it at the right time.

>What are peoples thoughts on Trophies and Medallions for the 1st/2nd/3rd place prizes?

It should be up to the tournament organiser and would be a nice touch.

--
bikepolo.com.au
urbanbicyclist.org

#13

antmandan

If you are willing to shell out a couple of grand to fly around the world to go to a bike polo tournament then good luck to you. If Australia happened to get 4 teams together for next years worlds I would hope that the organisers would allow room for them. If I was organising a world tournament in Australia I wouldn't be capping entry, rather expanding the tournament to suit the number of entries. I can understand qualification if the host city wants to enter 30 teams in a tournament that is expected to attract 50 or so teams, but when you're talking about someone flying halfway around the world for a tourney wouldn't you want them to be included? The whole idea of capping entries outside your region seems silly. For the same reason with this years Nationals we aren't capping entries anywhere. Let everyone play and have a good time. If Melbourne wanted to bring 10 teams then I would see no problem with that at all, it just makes the event bigger and more inclusive. Clever seeding after the first round on the Saturday will hopefully ensure that everyone plays like-skilled teams and has a good time, and those of you who want the title will have your day in the sun. Remember that not everyone plays to win, some just want to have some fun.

My vote is for one national per year, the date of which is set by the organisers. They know their city best and which month will be best in terms of weather, court availability and so forth. Just give us all good notice as to dates so that we can book flights.

#14

brox

Sydney Bike Polo

I agree with lewis that rankings and point systems are too hard and the field of players too small at this stage to set it up. It would only be to serve an ego and not that great for such a growing sport that needs to make it easy for newbies to get involved.

I dont agree with having 'majors'. This sounds like just a renaming of a normal 'invitational' tourney. It works in america with such a large population of players and areas where they filter teams for the larger tournaments. We have never had enough players in one tourney to consider filtering. Perhaps once the sport is larger this idea can be proposed again.

It sounds like it just comes down to having an even spread of tournaments across the country (and NZ) where everyone knows in advance when the next ones will be. I agree to allow each city the chance to select a date first, before a larger city to choose three or four dates.

Perhaps what is needed is just communication between each city before selecting dates for an invitational tourney. The nationals up in Brisbane would be a good place to go over a calendar and each city put down when they want to hold an invitational tourney.

#15

mossko

Melbourne

Just though of something..

How about each city propose a date for their "main" tournament which is included in the calendar

The we go around again each city for 2nd tournaments, 3rd, 4th etc. That way everyone gets a fair share, and cities who plan on hosting more than 1 tournament have an opportunity to do so

As new cities come on board, this exercise may need to be repeated or new cities can slot in to some open date

What do you guys think about this?

mossko / Rob M
http://www.vimeo.com/ mossko | http://www.bikepolo.com.au/ | http://www.flickr.com/photos/mosskopolo

#16

mossko

Melbourne

The cities I am aware of right now are as follows:

Melbourne
Sydney
Brisbane
Perth
Adelaide
Newcastle
Gold Coast
Castlemaine
Seaford / Frankston
Christchurch
Auckland

mossko / Rob M
http://www.vimeo.com/ mossko | http://www.bikepolo.com.au/ | http://www.flickr.com/photos/mosskopolo

#17

Dingo

Melbourne

Albury
Healesville/Warburton (kinda)

--
bikepolo.com.au
urbanbicyclist.org

#18

buildingbridges...

Toronto

Thanks for clearing that up rob. This i what i was trying to get at.

#19

squid

Adelaide Bicycle Polo Club

Adelaide is willing and able to hold the nats next year, but we still need to get a consensus at the nats

#20

squid

Adelaide Bicycle Polo Club

Also I'm not sure if we should restrict ourselves to public holidays for major events, since flights are usually more expensive and a lot of people would have other plans

#21

brox

Sydney Bike Polo

squid wrote:

Also I'm not sure if we should restrict ourselves to public holidays for major events, since flights are usually more expensive and a lot of people would have other plans

Agreed. Most people can get a single day off work, if not they can fly down later that night or in the morning.

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