Machine Politics vs Beaver Boys, May 2011. Photo by Bruce Carver
Hello my name is Jake, I'm from Atlanta, and I'm the Tournaments Committee chair for NA Hardcourt. We've been working hard to develop a system to distribute spaces at worlds. After taking a vote the system has passed and we are now beginning worlds space allocation.
Na Hardcourt was allotted 27 by Berlin. To fairly and quickly distribute them we'd like to award spaces two ways. First spaces based on Merit, and second an even distribution through the regions
First we'd like to award 13 spaces to teams that feel they have a merit based claim to a space at worlds ( NA champs, Worlds podium, ESPI champs, etc). The merit can be based on both individual performance of each team member, and on the performance of the team as a whole. We will accept applications for these spaces for one week beginning now (April 15th-23rd). Applications can be sent to NAhardcourtworlds2010@gmail.com with the word MERIT in the subject line. Applications should include all three team members names, user names, email addresses, and tournament placements for each member. After applications are in the Tournaments Committee will decide which teams are awarded merit spaces. All 13 teams will be notified on Sunday April 25th), by email and they will have one week(April 25th-May 2nd) to pay their registration fee to be considered registered. All teams NOT awarded merit spaces will also be notified via email as well.
We'd also like to allow teams that are committed to going to worlds to compete, even if they do not have the greatest tourney record. To this end we will open 14 spaces (2 per region) to the forum on lottery basis. Teams can place their name in a virtual hat for one week(April 22- April 30th). Any team not awarded a merit based spot can apply for a lottery spot. Teams wishing to apply for the lottery should email NAhardcourtworlds2010@gmail.com with the word LOTTERY in the subject line. The email should include all three players names, user names, email addresses, and the region they are applying in. If at the end of that week a region has not taken both its spaces they will be redistributed to teams from other regions that had more applicants. Teams will be notified by email Sunday May 2. Once a team gets a spot they have one week to pay their registration fee to be considered registered (deadline May 9th). If a team doesn't register by the deadline their space will be given to the next team from the lottery.
Paypal will be used for us to collect the registration fees, and we will then transfer the lump sum to Berlin when all NA registration is complete.
Thank you for your patience
That's what should be happening. I was more trying to plan on regions that don't take their full 2 spaces. Say none or 1 teams apply. The remaining spaces will be given out on a lottery among all entrants. I really don't expect steps 5 and 6 to happen, but deadlines are important.
Or you could reassess based on merit at that point instead of a random lottery.
x2
sherry william is the new ben hunter
8) all your spots are belong to London
9) No one from London will place higher than anyone from North America
Bring it mutherfucker. London will defile NYC on the court.
that's not really a continuation of the world's space distribution formula.. you see how 8) was a continuation of the prior 7 steps by asserting that if there are available spots, london has able and willing teams to fill them, but your step 9) addresses a completely different subject. maybe a) or i) would have been more suitable
Can we say if this system will be used next year or not?
i'd really like to see us put this into place to track stats this year.
it's simple and it works.
borrowed from a bmx points ranking system
my example is....
tournament organizers submit an application to the na governing body for inclusion in the nation points system.
then based on the number of entrants at that tournament points would be alloted as such.
for an 8 team tournament ...
the first place finish would be worth 9 points
second place would be worth 7 points
third would be 6 points
fourth would be 5 points
fifth would be 4 points
sixth would be 3 points
seventh would be 2 points
eighth would be 1 point
here is an example of a 32 team tournament:
1st Place = 50 Points
2nd Place = 47 Points
3rd Place = 45 Points
4th Place = 44 Points
5th Place = 43 Points
6th Place = 42 Points
7th Place = 41 Points
8th Place = 40 Points
9th Place = 35 Points
10th Place = 32 Points
11th Place = 30 Points
12th Place = 29 Points
13th Place = 28 Points
14th Place = 27 Points
15th Place = 26 Points
16th Place = 25 Points
17th Place = 20 Points
18th Place = 17 Points
19th Place = 15 Points
20th Place = 14 Points
21st Place = 13 Points
22nd Place = 12 Points
23rd Place = 11 Points
24th Place = 10 Points
25th Place = 9 Points
26th Place = 7 Points
27th Place = 6 Points
28th Place = 5 Points
29th Place = 4 Points
30th Place = 3 Points
31st Place = 2 Points
32nd Place = 1 Points
these would be individual points awarded to each player allowing mixed city teams a way to be in the rankings
tournaments that have a superiour competitive value but dont have the larger attendance( northside as an example ) can be double points events to give them a simular value for winning.
comments?
I have a few thoughts.
first, if there is no limit to the number of tournaments a player or team can add point to their stats with then the favor would go to players or teams that simply enter a greater number of tournaments and less favor to teams who do better but enter less tournaments. Maybe you see the point I'm making here. I'm just saying there is a chance that the stats could be stacked. Unless... Any one player or team of players are limited to enter an X number of tournament stats.
example: Player A goes to 20 tournaments and enters best 3 results. Player B goes to 5 tournaments and enters best 3 results. Thoughts?
second, it takes a great number of games to find out who ends up 1,2 and 3. I think it would take too much time and space to get to who is 31st and 32nd. Would it not be tied for 8th, tied for 12th, tied for 16th and so on. Minor point but, I've been to larger tournaments and not seen the 3rd place game played so 2 teams are credited with "tied for 3rd"
last, I'm confused about the number of entrants and max points for 1st. In your example 1st out of 8 is 9 points but first out of 32 is 50 points. How does this break down?
thanks,
In response to your first point, there is an easy fix: just take the average rather than adding. So players with higher averages have done better at tournaments with more teams.
To your second point, I think we should only give points for top 16 or maybe even just top 10 finishers.
We could also use the 2011 World's bidding process to demand that host cities be able to fit more teams and/or go for more days. It would limit the possible hosts, which would stink a little. But it would also increase the number of players at the event, which would be cool.
1. I think if there were a limited number of tournaments in the system say 4 per region and allow the freedom to play in any region. take your best 3 results could be a way to solve the first issue.
2. With more tournaments using more than 1 court it should not be too hard to figure out at the least top 10.
3. The points drop 10 points every 8 teams. I still think the larger tournaments should have a higher value for winning.
If you can/want to go to Berlin but lack a full team, please post here or just let me know. The time to commit is now. Players with some tourney record and an ability to go need to come together now to have any chance of getting a spot.
I fall in this category. Should we do BM style bios?
I am going to Berlin, would like to play but do not have a team. I'm probably a C player with a B streak.
Did I read that wrong?
Who am I being asked to send my money to?
I think I'll be sending my money directly to Berlin if that's alright with you.
First, can you please clarify how the "lottery" system will be chosen? Is it a true random lottery? While technically "fair", this seems a little strange. I would think it would be more appropriate to have regional reps collectively make the decisions as to who from their region should attend. Isn't that kind of why we have regional reps?
ALSO, I would like to make a plea for all regional reps to please make a point to distribute this information to your players. The forum is a confusing place to find information sometimes and I would hate for folks to buy plane tickets or register and then realize that they had to go through this system.
From a strictly observational standpoint, I agree. Regional reps should get to be in charge of submitting the teams from their region. This random draw thing seems a little odd.
This just sounds overly complicated to me. The purpose of these committees shouldn't be to make an entire new set of rules for every little problem that the sport has. Stick with what has been working: regional reps who know their constituents work things out by talking with the people they play polo with every season/all year.
I just think the government should be kept as local as possible. If 3 teams from the midwest want to go but only 2 are allowed, let the regional rep and the members of all the teams agree on a fair way to decide who gets to. If that means random, at least the team that gets left out feels part of the decision and an active participant in how it turned out, right? I'd much rather draw straws amongst friends than wait to hear back from a committee put in charge of my fate. Local governments are just better at adapting to the individual problems that are bound to arise. EH? EH????
How much is registration?
all london polo players WIL NOT MAKE THE TOP 10 i know i have see max knight play
here in canada we call max a wanker ha ha ha
here in canada we call max a wanker ha ha ha
Here in London we call you a knob. Hahahahaha!
thanks bill
here in canada we call him a knob too..
here in canada we call max a wanker ha ha ha
Here in London we call you a knob. Hahahahaha!
HERE IN CANADA WILL TAKE THOSE FIXES CLEAN THE COURT UP WITH THEM
THATS WHY MAXXX WENT FREEE WHEEL HE COULD NOT KEEP UP HE STILL CANT
ROBBIE CANT TAKE ME OUT BOARDZ
I disagree with the lottery. I still think a merit based decision for the final 14 teams is the way to go.
I fucking love you Joe. Daniel, I think we need to meet. But a polo tourney wouldn't be the right place. Joe, what would?
Martin is in on merit. I think his concern is that due to the lottery the top new orleans team gets in to the tournament over the 8th best East Van team or the 6th best MKE team. This would be a travesty.
Merit, merit, merit, merit.
This may be true on skill alone, but maybe cultural diversity is also important. Winning is great but each team that goes will also represent aspects of North America. Our region hasn't been playing as long but no one from MKE or East Van could do a good job of representing what New Orleans or any of the South Central offers culturally. I for one would like to see a New Orleans, Austin, or Colorado team go to Worlds.
Lottery is for gambling alcoholics. Merit is for WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP bike polo.
I've got two other 'probably's from Bay Area for Berlin. I want to give that a little more time, another week or so. Having a chance to actually play together makes a huge difference. Otherwise I'd be reaching out to some of the other loose cannons.
Boston has entered a lottery team. Flight tickets were paid for 2 months ago, so fingers crossed we get a spot. All 3 players were in Bench Minor black team.
Hey - just wanted to let everyone know that the Tournament committee has been closely following this thread and, also combined with some very reasonable, logical suggestions from outside LOBP, we are reviewing this selection process. Thanks for all the help everyone. Stay tuned.
I say everyone go to Berlin, Let them decide who gets in, and the rest of us that get denied will have our own pologuerilla tournament. (the messengers on this list will know what I'm talking about, or at least some of them, if they've been to enough CMWC's)
??? will tournys leading up to worlds be counted? as far as merit/placings/tournys attended/capability of travel.
i have a team in mind...
will there merit for how much beer you drink
this is getting crazy.....if your rich you go..poor you don't...Start looking for that dream job.
this is getting crazy.....if your rich you go..poor you don't...Start looking for that dream job.
I LIKE THAT BUT IT SHOULD SAY IF YOU POOOR U CANT GET RICH BECAUSE THE RICH PEOPLE DONT LIKE THE POOOOOOR
felonys dont help either huh? or wait what is it that they call um up in canuckiasp? oh wait i just googled it, you guys call it that too....
were teams notified via email yesterday (april 25)? if not, when will we know?
2 comments
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Sounds good.
Just for clarification:
1) An amount of teams from a region registers.
2) You hold a random lottery.
3) The two winners are notified.
4) The teams that are notified have one week to pay.
5) If a team doesn't pay/register you randomly choose a new team from the remaining teams from that region.
6) You repeat steps 4 and 5 until: a) all spots are filled from a region or b) there are no more teams in the region.
7) Once there are no more teams from the region you *then* distribute the spots from a particular region to other regions.
That correct?
I was just confused by when the spots get redistributed to other regions.