WHAAAAAA????
Pittsburgh No Longer Hosting ESPI 5
I am sorry to announce that Pittsburgh will no longer be hosting ESPI 5 in 2010. We were initially optimistic about being able to provide housing/food/etc for such an event, but our issue now has become playing surface. After speaking with people at the St. Louis Lock-In, we have decided that our courts will not be sufficient for a major tournament like the ESPI. The standards are pretty high these days, and our courts are not simply not large enough or consistent enough to match those standards. I apologize for any inconvenience this causes, though I think that there is plenty of time to find a replacement host and plan the tournament. Additionally, we still intend to host some form of polo event on the proposed weekend (May 29-30) with those details to be announced as soon as they are available.
-Jonathan
You guys should still do it. DC through an awesome ESPI at rush rink and the Thunder Dome. Have you ever played RR? TD? If a tournament can be held in the TD, without hay bales even, it can be held just about any where.
You guys can DO THIS!!!
I was watching youtube videos awhile back from the earliest of early midwest championships, where games were played on parkinglots without backs. imagine that, a championship in the middle of a parkinglot. fastforward a couple years and sure the sport has evolved some, and yeah theres some awesome courts out there, but when it gets down to it, its still about getting together and playing bike polo and seeing whose city/state/region/etc. is best.
and I'm sure whatever courts you have will be better than a parking lot (and even if it were a parkinglot I think many of us would still come).
you guys got this! kill this self-doubt and just focus on throwing the best tournament to your ability, no ones going to fault you for that
You are going to let some drunken-sleep-deprived, bad advice keep your city from hosting one of the best tournaments? Most of the people that were at the STL Lock-in wont be attending the ESPI's anyway. I'm guessing Pittsburg is a big city with a lot of pavement. Find a place to make it work. It's not like this hasn't been done before.
In other words: Don't give up without a fight.
sorry guys, but you're backing out because of this? many cities host and many have poor surfaces, and many have great surfaces. but where everyone plays isn't always great, and that's part of the beauty and charm of playing in other cities. you get to learn and grow as a player, including surface differences....
and this also all begs the question about the quality of hosting, and the abilities of the host city? are we going to as a group move forward into mandatory standards? it seems like pittsburgh doesn't feel they are up to par...
why are you jumping down their throats? if they don't wanna do it they dont have to. They were nominated as a result of some internet banter, not assigned by the polo czar's. Someone will end up doing it, and if not, then so fucking what. Theres a million other tournaments next year we can all blow our money on traveling to.
It was not an easy decision to retract our offer to host. 2010 will be our 3rd year as a polo club, and we were very excited and flattered that there were people suggesting that we do it. I also understand fully that it's not the court, it's the play. Any new court has its quirks and advantages, and it's up to everyone to change their game accordingly.
Our concern was to not bust our asses to put on a tournament, have everyone bust their asses to come to it, and then have people be disappointed by and critical of our courts. When there was concern over the date, we worked through that, but when we talked to people about court size at StL (I was sober for the entire event, if it matters), we came to a pretty sound consensus that our facilities weren't quite proper for ESPI. When I came home and talked to our club, we decided that it would be best if we didn't host a competitive tournament like ESPI for everyone's benefit. We did not want anyone to have a sub-par tournament, and most of all, I personally did not want our club to work so hard to put on a tournament that most of us won't play in only to hear negative feedback about the quality of our facilities.
The long and short of it is this: Pittsburgh wanted to host some kind of 2-day event on Memorial Day weekend. When ESPI's were offered to us, it sounded like a great idea. We met and assessed our resources, and we know that we can welcome the 90+ people a 2-day/2-court tournament brings. Additionally, we know that no one that shows up will have a bad time. I have to remain firm on retracting our offer to host ESPI in 2010. If that casts me/us in an unflattering light, so be it. My club is behind this decision, and I am with them.
It means a lot to receive this kind of support. I appreciate your encouragement, but it is not a matter of self-doubt. We are confident as a club that this was the right decision for us, and we hope that in the end, that it was the right decision for everyone.
How did you have any time to talk at the Lock-in? You were on the court every other game.
what is this "horrible" court size?
Our main court is about 120' x 65'. The court with lights is about 95' x 55'. The surfaces are playable and do not affect traction/handling, though they can cause the ball to skip. The main court has one corner that is slightly sunken in. Both courts are ovals and fully enclosed with chain-link fencing. If anyone would like to know anything else about them, please ask. I live within 3 blocks of both courts. If no one has any objections to us hosting a major given the dimensions, then it appears that our club will do it.
I feel the need to apologize for making a mountain out of what is now being shown to be a mole hill. It was my intent to ensure that the ESPI saw a fit host, and I have obviously misjudged people's expectations for facilities. Thanks for the encouragement and constructive discussions.
The courts we built for our tournament here were 112'x56'. They were more than adequate in my opinion.
I think you should give up as much info as possible. If everyone agrees they're sufficient, anyone that complains after the fact can get fucked.
Just so everyone knows for certain and there is a written confirmation: Can we assume this means Pittsburgh will be hosting the ESPI's? and once you reply YES we can close this thread and start a new one titled "Pittsburgh Is No Longer No Longer Hosting ESPI 5"
Thank you for dealing with this in a timely manner.
I'd love to start that thread, Ian, but I cannot give you a definitive answer as of right now. I know that this feels like it's taking forever in internet time, but getting everyone here together to settle things isn't as immediate. If it's any consolation, it's only been a week, and that only matters if whoever hosts sticks to Memorial Day weekend. Take my word that we're on it, and I'll have an answer as soon as I can. Thanks everyone for your patience.
Ok, so what are the other options, people?
RVA?
Pittsburgh - If the only thing holding you back or discouraging you from hosting ESPI's is the conflicting schedule then you should hold ESPI's. It's a regional invite tournament. It's really flattering that everyone across the continent likes to come to this specific tourney but it isn't necessary.
You should hold Espi's. Richmond won't do it until they have a solid place to play. NY, Philly, Boston, DC have all done it. Florida as much as I love visiting is just too damn far for the northern teams. Ideally in regards to location it should be held in VA, WVA, MD, DE or NC. Those are the most centrally located states on the East side. 3 of them don't have any players that we know of.
If you are worried about surface or playing field size, then again, do not let this discourage you. Yes the stakes are high but in all fairness this is about having fun when it comes down to it. Sure it's not fun for you cuz organizing tournaments sucks.Essentially you are providing a different setting for people to play polo and giving them a chance to break away from the rigamarole of every day life to do something they enjoy. It also just happens to be highly competitive.
As Eastside Representative I highly implore you to revitalize your planning and host the ESPI's this year. Plus, I haven't been to Pittsburgh in years and I never had a bad time.
I put all this in the other thread but I don't know that anyone is reading that anymore. If you don't want to host that certainly will be respected. Problem now is we need to find someone who will.
Standards, shmandards. Despite all the organizing and trying to make tournaments better, I think we should still keep those factors in mind that make bike polo so great; the variety, sponteneity and adaptability of players and the game itself.
I think it is a bit naive to expect every city who wants to host an event to have courts that stack up to other cities' standards.
Pittsburgh - If you are going to go to the trouble of hosting a tournament that weekend you might as well host the ESPI's. That way you at least guarantee a strong showing. If you host a tournament that weekend and it is in conflict with ESPI's being held somewhere else you might as well just call it pick-up and not a tournament.
I still think you should hold the ESPI's. Don't worry about the potential backlash of people complaining or not having a good time. People will always whine about shit but they never regret going out of town to play polo.
Wow... I just found this thread and I'm kind of bummed. I'm not going to try to change your mind Lomax, but you guys need to have some sort of tourney. July 4th last year was a BLAST! and I'm not just saying that because my team won. #yeahijustsaidthat
Like I said, no one is going to have a bad time that comes to Pittsburgh. But what we're wondering is, is the final game under the lights on a court half the size of Worlds/Dayton's Midwests going to be anticlimactic? Maybe I/we are over-reacting, but the backlash in Philly was fierce and we refuse to let people's memory of ESPI in Pittsburgh be one of disappointment ("I travelled this far/paid however much and played on that?") I don't think I'm being unrealistic in how cautious we are in hosting a major on our turf. I want to add that I am not taking any personal offense nor am I building any resentment toward anyone over this. We play here, and we love it. This is the type of discussion that we were all looking for, and I'll still crash on your floor, drink your beer, and blast your 5-hole no matter how this plays out. The same hospitality will always be available to anyone that comes to PGH...
Except you, Brian. Bring a tent.
HAHA!! I'll pitch a tent and blast you moms 2-hole! #boosh!
The stakes for the worlds were very high. The expectations were very high. Even the most basic of these were not met and it was very clear why.
The stake and expectations for a regional are not nearly that. You're also a newer club who hasn't yet thrown a big tourney. We all know that.
Ask the region for help (something that didn't happen in Philly) and we will help. As long as you guys do your absolute best to throw this thing, it will be fantastic. That and don't let Chombos bike get stolen.
If your referring to your court you used on the 4th, I thought it was a fun court to play in and I like that its not a sterotypical court. As for size the court that Philly used before it came to nyc was about the same size. Maybe I would like it to be in PGH because its closer to me, either way I'll try to be there if ESPI5 is not there. Do it. Do it. Do it...Everyone wants to come to the Iron City
All right. This was not expected. I am going to see most of our club at Black & Gold Sprints tonight. The rest, I will see tomorrow at pick-up. This positive support will undoubtedly give everyone something to think about. It seems that the consensus is "fuck nit-picking, bring your A-game," and while that isn't a surprise, we did not expect it to be such a vocal and popular opinion. I am not promising anything, but I will have a final decision tomorrow. In the very least, I will also have dimensions of the courts (I meant to have that info ready, Ryan Pcola, but I dropped the ball). As for now, I'm at work wearing out the buttons on my phone trying to stay on top of this, so pardon my slow responses. Thanks everyone, and take care
Jonathan
1. We still intend to host some form of polo event on the proposed weekend (May 29-30)
2. We know that we can welcome the 90+ people a 2-day/2-court tournament brings.
3. Additionally, we know that no one that shows up will have a bad time.
Sounds like you're going to be doing 95% of the work to throw a big tournament, why not keep it as ESPI5? Rush Rink in DC is barely 100' long and the Thunderdome is smaller than a single normal basketball court. Still, pretty much everyone at ESPI3 had a great time.
I hope you all decide to do it, I haven't been to Pittsburg in years and was looking forward to the trip.
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The thing is, when the bar is raised to such a high degree (as with the last Midwests in COMO), and especially when a large number of folks get to play on an exceptionally awesome court, there is always that period of time following where everyone gushes on and on about it, and how every tournament / court should be like that from now on.
I'm not saying that this is a bad thing; because I think at best, it causes other cities to aspire to making their own courts better and/or finding better playing spots and methods of hospitality. But at the same time, the reality is not every tournament is going to be as awe-inspiring as the last.
Try your best within your limitations to put on a tournament that everyone can enjoy... I think that is all that we can reasonably expect.
when the bar is raised to such a high degree (as with the last Midwests in COMO.
aw, you gon' make us blush...
Wow, i can't believe how many people forgot how after Philly everyone was saying that all that matters is the court, everything else is secondary.
Important tournaments should have good courts.
haha that's what i was just thinking.
my 2 cents concerning all of this:
i think it's time for the regional tournaments to be exclusive to their regions. it makes sense in terms of seeding for the nationals/worlds. and it makes it easier for the host city.
What bothered people about the courts in Philly was more about the pathetic attempt to run 6 inch plastic boards zip-tied to garbage bag-wrapped hay bails. This assembly was weak, fell apart & ruined the standard of play. A better assembly of boards would have made those courts playable & enjoyable.
In your case (PGH): If the effort has been made to make an un-ideal situation better by making good boards or finding additional playing surfaces, people will have a good time & not have a reason to bitch.
First off, Pittsburgh, I'm bummed that you've decided to retract, but respect the fact that you're honest with yourselves about what you can and can't provide. I can't wait to come to Iron City for a kick-ass tournament - at whatever scale. You guys/gals, as players and people, are top notch.
Second, NYC!!! Where you at, my homies? Let's do this! Let's host ESPI and pair it with the Women's tournament. World's was just in Philly, there hasn't been a Major in NYC in a long time - we need the practice if we're going to bid on World's next year.
Who's IN???
Eastside monthly pickup is in Philly tomorrow (Saturday 1/23) at the good court from Worlds.
I'm expecting to see people from Philly,NY,DC,Boston, and RVA. Let's try and hash this out there a little bit and figure out how we can do this. .
I'm not opposed to Cecily's suggestion to rally NYC's club as a host, either.
NYC!
NYC would be dope but what about burlington vertmont?
Let's just kill the ESPI. Overrated, 2 bit, small potato, day trip tournament if ever there was one.
actually f nyc, Milwaukee will be hosting the ESPI!
that would be rad. lets play in the ramp and see if they arrest all 200 of us. we might be considered a militia with all that mallet weaponery. maybe they send the gaurd. but you realize if were east side then so is austin. is that what we really want? to be in the same group as those whiners?
West Side for East Side. Portland will host.
Quit being a bitch Lomax. Dang. Cleveland will be there regardless so you might as well just have the damn tournament.
paul brought up a good point yesterday at pickup that if pgh requests help with specific things (court surface, boards, bathrooms, dealing with the city) then chances are there's someone on here that's already dealt with similar problems before. i can't promise any solutions personally, but i think if you set out issues that need to be resolved then you'd be likely to find a ton of help on here.
if necessary there are probably some folks that are willing to come up early and put in some work before the tournament to make it happen. i don't know what surface you're playing on but it might be possible to repair it without too much time or expense.
if you prepare well and get help and something still goes wrong, i think you'll find you have a lot of people in your corner and very few complainers.
but if you can't or don't want to commit, that's totally OK too. do what's right for you guys, knowing that you've got help if you need it. my next choices would be ny and dc/college park, for obvious reasons.
okay after some discussion with the eagle, i'm willing to host espi in baltimore, md as long as i'm given sufficient time to secure some things. considering i'm the only player in baltimore this may cause some complications but i'll see what i can do. if you have any suggestions or ideas call me 443-278-1115.
If you want to make most everybody happy, look like you have a plan. Nobody will notice if you actually don't, just pretend like you know what you are doing
holy crap ignore me if you want but don't ever listen to ryan.
Pretend Philly?
fuck it come to the midwest champs in mpls DUH!!
We got together again last night, and our decision stands. We agree as a club that bigger tournaments like ESPI are better held in cities with facilities that Pittsburgh cannot offer at this time. This decision was made in full consideration of the responses that we received here, and we do not lack confidence in our abilities as a hosts or in our courts being suitable venues for holding events. We believe that certain events deserve specific accommodations, and subsequently, we are not willing to host ESPI at this time. I apologize again for any trouble that this has caused, but I do not regret making this decision.
I think that we should use this as an ice-breaker for further conversation about court expectations for specific types of tournaments. Though the majority of the responses in this thread were of the opinion that such considerations are not necessary, I would find it hard to believe that there are not people of the opposite opinion out there. I'm going to start a thread in the Courts section for that.
Thanks and good luck to the new host of ESPI 5.
some will always find something to bitch about, but my opinion is that courts should be at the top of the list of considerations along with places for people to stay.
I'm not out to bash people for bitching, but I think that you hit it on the head. #1 and #2 are courts and crash space. The rest (food, prizes, beer, entry fees) is subject to what you say in the event details, but those two considerations are the bare minimum when you invite people to your city.
We're going to Broltimore!!! I hope I run in to Bubbles.
I mean no offense to Oriole's organizational acumen, but haven't we as a sport learned that one person acting alone or as a dictator can not do a good job hosting a major tournament? There are just too many details, expectations, and attendees.
+1 on what Lucky said.
seriously though, is Tommy/Oriole serious? What sort of courts does he have access to? I'm a big fan of Baltimore, and if he has courts and a means to house people, i'm not totally ruling it out.
that said, NYC is getting together on Sunday to talk about hosting this event. We've got a lot of people here who are excited about chipping in and putting this on in New York.
This discussion is happening in the Eastside region group now, so i'm closin this thread.
bad joke
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